Home News Screener Maps Groups Portfolio Insider Collaborate Forum
  • Search

Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Members | Log In | Register

Looks like we are heading lower Options
STI
Posted: Monday, September 08, 2008 12:03:21 PM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 8/11/2008
Posts: 82
Expect this bailout to be exact reverse of BSC bailout where the market gapped down and closed strong. That in-turn led to strong up trend.

Commodities and techs are looking vulnerable and the shorts I've been posting are working like a charm. Never thought this is going to turn out to be this worse.



STI,
Stock Trading Ideas
http://stock-trading-ideas.com
stockman
Posted: Monday, September 08, 2008 12:40:53 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/15/2008
Posts: 240
SSG, UltraShort Semiconductor ProShares, is showing the breakdown of the semiconductor sector, hitting a low at market open of 70 and now at 80.71 with the market reaction to the Fre/Fnm and the subsequent sell off. It is up 23% for the week. This shows you have to be able to stomach these wild swings in a bear market and my stomach hurts.
zigzagman
Posted: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:53:37 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 8/14/2008
Posts: 314
Location: Memphis
UNBELIEVABLE! The government steps in just in the nick of time to save the market from crashing...AGAIN!

Bear Sterns, Amback and MBNA, now the GSE's... What's next???... The airlines and then the automakers? We might as well start calling our country the United Socialistic States of America (USSR)...lol

I watched CNBC from before the opening bell until after the closing bell today, so I heard a number of opinions pro and con on this bailout of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. But...WOW! Just take a look at the DOW chart for today. It appears the market liked it. Let's see if these gains can holds up this week. I have a feeling by the end of this week, we'll have given most of today's gains back.

I feel sorry for the Fannie and Freddy shareholders that woke up to their stock opening down almost 90% this morning. And it's us taxpayers that will be footing the bill for the GSE's bailout. Oh, great....Gee, thanks...For nothing.

The chart pattern already looks bad, and a downward move from here will make it look that much worse.






www.stock-market-lessons.com
stockman
Posted: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 12:13:19 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/15/2008
Posts: 240
This is a quote from the “big picture” by Barry Ritholtz



"Another weekend, another bailout, another market reaction:



How many Sunday press releases is it going to take to save the financial system from ruin? If you’re are keeping score at home, this is now the sixth Sunday night/Monday morning press release in 14 months aimed at saving the financial system. Consider the recent history of these weekend rescues:



• August 2007, when the credit crunch was officially recognized by the Fed, when they cut the discount rate.

• December 2007, with the announcement of the TAF and other credit facilities.

• January 2008 Soc Gen panic, and a 75 bps emergency cut.

• March 2008 with the Bear Stearns bailout.

• July 2008 the first Fannie/Freddie rescue attempt.

• September 2008 the actual Bailout of Fannie/Freddie.



Observations/questions/takeaways from the past of weekend rescues history:



1. A strong rally lasts for a while, but it eventually fades and makes a new lower low.

2. Each "rescue rally" has been shorter in duration and weaker in intensity than the immediately prior one.

3. Friday's close becomes your new line in the sand; If and when that is breached, look out below.

4. The pre-Asian open news pattern reveals the Asset price focus is a large part of these issues; It also speaks to our overseas creditors/Overlords.

5. What form of free markets have we evolved into? It is not Capitalism, it is not Socialism, it is not intelligent regulation. WTF is this?!?



Lastly, who wants to bet me that this will be the very last bailout? Any takers? Any?"

zigzagman
Posted: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 6:04:18 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 8/14/2008
Posts: 314
Location: Memphis
I wrote this yesterday, two posts above this one:

zigzagman wrote:
Let's see if these gains can holds up this week. I have a feeling by the end of this week, we'll have given most of today's gains back.

I guess we don't have to wait until the end of the week. All of the gains made Monday by the Fannie and Freddie bailout have been taken back IN ONE SESSION thanks in part to Lehman Bros. (LEH) dropping nearly 44% today.

I guess we'll have another news release this Sunday too, about the FED bailing LEH out.

Who's NEXT?...Are we going to bail out Starbucks and Krispy Kreme too?...They are both "too big to fail"...
After all, the world would be a much sadder place with our fat, caffiene, and sugar fixes taken away...lol





www.stock-market-lessons.com
stockman
Posted: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 7:53:29 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/15/2008
Posts: 240
Once again, everything bear market "ultra short" were today's top performers in etf's - REC, DUG, EEV, FXP, SMN, SKF, MZZ, SRS, SSG, SSK, & TWM. for an average gain of 7 to 13% in the group for the day. I suggest to you again that if the market continues down, this is a way to start making money. The problem will be that if the market starts going down too much and too fast, the next Fed rescue of the market will be reducing the interest rate again. If Lehman keeps going closer to zero, we will probably have another rescue this weekend as zigzagman suggested. Need to have tight stops for these Fed interventions for the big upswings that only seem to last a day before the downward slide happens again. Since this 200 point up swing was only a day, you could buy more bear market etf's rather than stopping out your current holdings.
stockman
Posted: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 1:04:49 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/15/2008
Posts: 240
Zigzagman and STI:

Cramer said tonight that in a worst case scenario, fertilizer stocks could drop 80% to their April 2005 levels. Could you please check your charts and see what they say in the short term. My interpretation in looking at the charts is that they have dropped below support and are sinking fast. I am thinking that pot has gone up the most and so could fall the furthest if this is true. What say you, wise men ?
Qtrade
Posted: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 2:59:14 AM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/12/2008
Posts: 52
Stockman:

I've been considering a similiar strategy, shorting previous top gainers from basic materials and/or shorting stocks that are above key technical levels - as too many of them were broken in this sector. However, oil is near probably the strongest support in the market $100, and if it reverses to around 110-115 then all these shorts would be losers.
STI
Posted: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 9:09:05 AM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 8/11/2008
Posts: 82
stockman wrote:
Zigzagman and STI:

Cramer said tonight that in a worst case scenario, fertilizer stocks could drop 80% to their April 2005 levels. Could you please check your charts and see what they say in the short term. My interpretation in looking at the charts is that they have dropped below support and are sinking fast. I am thinking that pot has gone up the most and so could fall the furthest if this is true. What say you, wise men ?


Stockman:

I have been outright bearish on ags/ferts since late July. I posted my trades for MON, MOS, BTU and highlighted other names on my blog.

Like Cramer, I wouldn't put a price tag on how low these stocks will go but they sure look to be rolling over. I don't want to bash Cramer as there are too many out there already doing it. But he doesn't know a thing what he is talking about. Checkout the videos from Don Harrold on youtube. That explains a lot about the character of Cramer.

Since nothing goes straight up or down, commodities look ripe to bounce any time soon. But this will be another rally in a bear phase which will give good entry points to short them again.

Hope that helps...

sti,
http://stock-trading-ideas.com


STI,
Stock Trading Ideas
http://stock-trading-ideas.com
stockman
Posted: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 9:37:56 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/15/2008
Posts: 240
Commodity Crush
Posted By:Tom Brennan
Topics:Commodities | John McCain | Natural Gas | Stock Picks | Stock Market
Sectors:Oil and Gas
Companies:Agrium Inc. | Potash Corporation of Saskatchewan Inc. | Mosaic Company | United States Steel Corporation | Cia Vale do Rio Doce

Commodities have been crushed and it doesn’t look like the decline will stop any time soon.

Why’s this happening? Cramer put the blame on a few key factors:

China, the once-great consumer of commodities, has virtually disappeared. Oil, steel, copper – you name it and China bought it with near insatiable fervor. Now that demand has dropped, and so have the prices of these commodities, as well as commodity-related stocks including infrastructure names and the rails.

Then there’s the McCain factor. He’s either pulled even with Obama in the polls or he’s ahead. And this is a guy who wants to drill, drill, drill. That means more supply and as a result lower prices. Cramer said a barrel of oil could drop to $80 and prices at the pump to $3.25.

Natural gas is hurting oil prices, too. Turns out we’ve got a ton of it here in the U.S. in shales spread out across the country. T. Boone Pickens has been talking up the resource is his pro-alternative energy commercials and now people are thinking we have enough nat gas to drop the price per 1,000 cubic feet to $5 from $7. Nat gas stocks could drop right along with the fuel.

Hedge funds have also played a roll in the commodities crash, but not exactly the way people think. These funds have huge investments in commodities-related stocks, and recently they’ve taken big losses. Now their clients want their money back, so the hedge funds are being forced to sell their positions en masse to raise money for these redemptions. So it’s not so much that hedge funds are hurting futures prices. In fact, they’re hurting the stocks that deal with these commodities. Cramer called the decline as a result of this huge sell-off “breath-taking.”

Another problem is that none of these stocks have dividends. If they did, then there’s probably be some buyers looking to pick them up on the cheap. These are the buyers – dividend seekers – who usually save a stock from total collapse when the market takes a downturn.

Cramer predicted a worst-case scenario for these names: They could lose all the gains they’ve seen since April 2005. That means Vale [RIO Loading... () ] drops 68%; U.S. Steel [X 96.06 2.37 (+2.53%) ] 50%; fertilizer stocks like Potash [POT 142.61 2.35 (+1.68%) ], Mosaic [MOS 79.79 2.78 (+3.61%) ] and Agrium [AGU 67.83 1.18 (+1.77%) ] could fall 80% to 90%. But this is only if you believe that the rise of these stocks was due solely to the increased value of commodities and not any growth by the companies themselves, he said.

So what’s it going to take to stop this? The world’s central banks – U.S., Europe, even China – have to cut interest rates. Industry consolidation would help, too. A rate cut in China might revive that country’s appetite for commodities, and that would mean investors would be getting a great discount on all these stocks right now.

If China doesn’t come back, Cramer said, “the commodity collapse has the potential to bring down the whole market.”
Users browsing this topic
Guest


Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Main Forum RSS : RSS

YAFPro Theme Created by Jaben Cargman (Tiny Gecko)
Powered by Yet Another Forum.net version 1.9.1.8 (NET v2.0) - 3/29/2008
Copyright © 2003-2008 Yet Another Forum.net. All rights reserved.